Damaged

I wish Jim Oberstar would either:

a) learn how to read from a Tele-Prompter

or

b) memorize any future on-air speeches.

66 Comments

Charlie Murphy

about 12 years ago

He will be fired Nov 2nd. Can't wait. We need term limits.

Danny G

about 12 years ago

What about:

c) Learn to sit without having his legs spread way too far apart.

bluntcakes

about 12 years ago

Danny, You're too funny.

Piglet

about 12 years ago

@ Danny G

...EEEWWW!Perhaps it's from too much time on his bike seat?

TopOfTheHillMan

about 12 years ago

Oh Lord, Charlie!  I couldn't agree more!  Especially in this case.

Danny G

about 12 years ago

Possibly.  With all of the other shenanigans at the big debate last week, the main thing that's been haunting me has been that image of his Obercrotch.

baci

about 12 years ago

I like Obiwan-Kenoberstar. He'd have a train here by now if all the petro-junkies and my-ego-is-my-car types had put on their hu"man-pants" and got real about sustainability and the future of the planet. Trains (and mass transit) are the future, intelligent and sustainable resource use is TRUE CONSERVATIONISM. 

Why don't you Glenn Beck wannabes do something productive with your mouths and go share your teabags with each other.

Bad Cat!

about 12 years ago

"Obercrotch" - LOL
I'd challenge someone to photoshop that, but I don't really want to see it...

nbayuk

about 12 years ago

I agree with Baci. Oberstar could have created more jobs if he was not always fighting to maintain the ones that already exist. He has been fighting the conservative privateer machine who's only mission in life to employ as few people as possible and pay them the least amount applicable to the law. When the 148th was going to be axed from the budget in the early part of the decade, Oberstar and Dayton fought to keep it here. Cravaak wants the 148th gone ASAP to "cut uneccessary spending" out of the budget. And yes, the train should have been here by now but until the "flat earth society" gets its shit together, it won't happen.

fergus

about 12 years ago

"Oberstar" isn't a name you can have much fun with without stretching it. But "Cravaack?" It's a combo of "crevasse" and "crack," as in a really big craaack. And we all know what that implies.

Claire

about 12 years ago

I call him Cow Chip Cravaack. Why? Because the man is full of shit, and you'll step into it if you don't watch out. But Fergus is right: every time I see a Cow Chip sign, I think of a plumber's butt crack. And I know I'm not the only one.

jim

about 12 years ago

Sorry Liberbaci, but a good percentage of the population doesn't agree with your assimilation point of view. The only thing a train would have accomplished is providing a cheap trip for the grey heads to Hinckley. Oh, I forgot about Buehler- All aboard!! After all, being committed to the ideal of limited government and liberty of individuals is the true definition of liberalism, not your bastardized version. Why don't you Al Gore wannabees do something productive with your mouths and go and share each others gas?

year of glad

about 12 years ago

Well, I have to agree with Baci. Cravaack is the last person I want representing me, and if he wins, I'll lose a little faith in our community. 

There's a reason Oberstar has held the job for so long; He's reliable, intelligent, and he has got our best interest in mind.

Charlie Murphy

about 12 years ago

Amen Jim. Getting tired of bacinstocks and whining.

Tony D.

about 12 years ago

Isn't "being committed to the ideal of limited government and liberty of individuals" more the definition of libertarianism than it is liberalism?

Anyway, who else can't wait for this election cycle to end -- no matter who wins -- just so these fear-driven, tea-bagger trolls go back to their caves?

Lojasmo

about 12 years ago

What is this post about?

Oberstar needs to go, but it will not be this cycle.  He needs to step down, and let Ness or some  young progressive take he reigns.

Jim

about 12 years ago

Sorry Tony, you're reading the wrong dictionary. The wonderful people who brought nobility and morals to the DFL would be throwing up in your lunch bucket right now if they were alive and saw how you have perverted my Grandfathers party. And as a point, aren't the whiny granola crunchers the ones who are always afraid, hiding behind their unions because they can't assemble an original thought or stand up for themselves? After all, that's the ONLY reason Jimmy has stayed in office. He laughs at you everytime he sits in his comfy Washington palace while toasting the suckers you are. You are all truly pathetic. No wonder you need Uncle Sam's help for everything from health care to feeding your family. I'm surprised you can even tie your own shoes...

The Big E

about 12 years ago

Term limits are great, assuming what you intend is to ensure that corporate interests are able to steamroller underprepared legislators.

baci

about 12 years ago

Trains do a lot more than get gray-hairs to Hinckley. And when most of your "good percentage" turns gray, their tune will change along with their hair color. They'll be aching to head to the cities for a visit with the grandkids, dim sum and a bottle of vino in style and comfort on a train. 

Trains built the country, the automobile is a marketing gimmick designed to lock us all into the work/debt cycle, hook us on a controlled substance and and give us the illusion of freedom! Trains move a "good percentage" of the East Coast to work and home again every day. 

Every other civilized nation in the world is making massive investment (and making a lot of jobs in the process, rail jobs) in sustainable transportation infrastructure which doesn't rely on oil from political hotbeds and ensnare them in parts of the world in which they have no reason to be involved. You know who is creating the most high speed rail? You guessed it -- George Bush's war bank, the Chinese. 

Thanks to the neo-con military industrial Haliburtoons, our future generations now are paying through the nose for high-speed rail infrastructure ... Outside Wuhan in Hubei Province. Thanks mom and dad neo-con! All cuz Darth Cheney wanted a war to line his pockets. 

Seriously, I'm beyond amazed at the short-term memory loss of your "good percentage" must be having to good a time at their tea party -- the economy was already seriously borked (read slashed and burnt by the GOP) when Obama took office -- the convenient truth is I'm not a liberal, I'm a socialist. Yep!!! I said the "S" word. Not the "commie socialism" that glennrush limbeck has created to fuel their lies (and sell ads on their media-crity generators) but the socialism that arises from intelligent and intentional stewardship for the popular good, it's called market socialism. 

BTW Jim, if your mom doesn't rip up her social security check when she gets it, she's a socialist too! And I'm a Progressive to boot! You can fear the future or embrace it ... but you can't stop it coming. You can drive your car backward into it checking for potholes in the rear-view or get a drink with me in the observation deck on the club car, letting a robot drive while we play canasta with some cats in Bangalore, watching the wind farms roll past. You'll look good in skin-tight Lycra. See you in the future citizen!

German Chris

about 12 years ago

Amen Baci. Best post ever!

zra

about 12 years ago

There goes Jim again, spouting "facts" without "links" to back up his claims that "most" don't want things.

C'mon, buddy. This ain't the DCB. We likey the linkey.

zra

about 12 years ago

"No wonder you need Uncle Sam's help for everything from health care to feeding your family. I'm surprised you can even tie your own shoes..."

Keep reaching for that rainbow, Jim. I don't know many folk who have to rely on Uncle Sam for anything other than a tax return at the end of April. Not saying it doesn't happen, but you're hard pressed to find anyone here who fits your cookie-cutter profile.

I do love your Reynold's Wrap tinfoil hat world view, though. Gives me something to laugh at while I'm at work. You know, earning money, so I can support my family, pay my taxes, pay my mortgage and keep shoes on my kid's feet. It ain't easy, but gosh darnit, I do so hate standing in the breadlines asking for handouts.

You can take back America, Jim ... take us back to the good old days when women couldn't vote, "all men" were rich and white and little brown-skinned folk were called slaves ... you can take it back when you've pried it from my cold dead fingers. Ain't gonna be easy, though. I own guns, too.

If you're not a part of the solution, Jim, you're part of the problem. The problem right now is the lack of progress, and your backward view of progress is the problem.

Claire

about 12 years ago

Baci and Zra -- right on, brothers! Best responses ever!

B-man

about 12 years ago

Thanks for the laugh, Jim. Your arguments are again, very shallow. I thought you were working on this? 

Back to the thread ... Oberstar does need to get out of the way, but Cravaack is not the one.

Danny

about 12 years ago

Claire is just not a funny person.  At least not intentionally.  That "cow chip" thing was awful.  Just awful.

jim

about 12 years ago

Sorry Baci, but your form of socialism is best left in Eastern Europe. Americans don't want it. And yes, you are right. The economy was "borked" when Hussein took office. It was borked because of the money we spend on illegals daily, because of the lazy libs wanting lollipop mortgages orchestrated by the likes of Barney Frank, and because of bad spending habits (or saving if you prefer) by the brain-dead public living outside of their means. To blame it solely on the Republicans shows how deep your ignorance truly is. 

And your affinity for trains is puzzling. You really think that the gray-heads (myself included) will be lining up to take a train to Minneapolis? Sorry, won't happen. Another liberal idyllic dream. Typical for a socialist to have everyone pay for something that so few will use. 

The East Coast works because of population density, dummy. Rural service doesn't work. The rail networks in the countries used as good examples of efficient /economical rural rail service such as Europe and Japan, are subsidized by their governments to the tune of billions of dollars a year (much higher than the per-capita cost of Amtrak per citizen). Same thing with Via in Canada, and China. 

Also, the European-nationalized passenger and freight rail companies have been broken up as part of the European Union agreements. The rail infrastructures (tracks, bridges etc.) are considered national infrastructure, just like our highway system and air network. In the United States, the railroads are not. If you want to make a real comparison, you would have to nationalize our 200,000 miles of track. Great idea, huh? Especially because we do such a great job of maintaining our roads and  bridges. More taxes, more debt. That's what you want, though, isn't it? 

When it gets down to it, again, you want the government to own and run everything so it can be shared equally. My suggestion is this -- move to Europe instead of trying to make this your vision of what America should be. Or try Canada. 

And Zra, nice folksy posturing. Shucks, I love it when liberal crazies like you get their panties in a bunch. Glad to know you've got guns. Maybe you can use them to rastle up some grub when your employer lays your ass off and your too proud to stand in a bread line. 

The truth is that we won't have to pry it from your fingers, because you will be in that line, with your hand out, fingers stretched, just like your whiny liberal buddies. P.S. -- Do your own homework. I don't feel it's my job to substantiate everything I write to those that won't believe it anyway.

Paul Lundgren

about 12 years ago

This thread is turning into the "Time Warp." It's just a jump to the left. And then a step to the right.

dbb

about 12 years ago

Is that some new dance? I guess I need to get out more.

Tony D.

about 12 years ago

Jim:

1. Why assume "gray hairs" are the only potential customers for high-speed rail? I would use it to visit friends and family, take in a show or a game, etc., and I'm 47. College students could use it to commute to their hometowns and back--fewer cars on the road, lower need for more parking. Many who can't find work close to home could commute to just about any community along I-35 and bring those wages back here to spend. Just because you can't imagine yourself doing something (riding the train) or do not need something most Americans do need (affordable health care) does not necessarily mean those things are bad ideas. 

2. Adding support to your statements, such as links to online sources or at least attributions to original sources, gives your words credibility. That is taught in most high school writing courses and in Freshman Comp in colleges throughout the country and is considered the norm throughout, well, the planet. The reason so many here ridicule your words is that (besides their ridiculous content) without the support of hard facts, your words have absolutely no credibility, and your credibility is further compromised when you resort to name calling. The louder you yell and the more "clever" names you come up for those you oppose doesn't cover up your own fear and ignorance.

3. Can't wait to read the name you will make up for me in response to this!

Danny:

1. Could you please keep your infatuation and obsession with Claire to yourself--heck, you even hijack threads you start yourself so you can pull on her pigtails like a schoolboy! Even if it wasn't a home run, a play on words is a much more clever attempt at humor than pointing to someone's crotch and giggling like a middle schooler. Does your wife know how often Claire invades your thoughts? Watching your obsession play out on the PDD is getting embarrassing.

jim

about 12 years ago

Paul, I appreciate your venue. So much so, that in appreciation, I'd like to buy you a beer at my favorite spot. Stop by and see me at Murphy's next time you are downtown. You can usually find me in the basement playing pool or listening to the Inkspots on the jukebox.

jim

about 12 years ago

Yeah Tony, because Barnum and Moose Lake are such hotbeds of commerce, I can see loads of people training it to work. Give it up. We're a nation of auto loving gas pigs -- that ain't gonna change! And name calling? Don't live in a glass house pal -- all of you pots love to call the kettle black.

Danny

about 12 years ago

Tony D: Thank you for pointing out my stupid posts where I point out her stupid posts.  Also, as I've said before, the wife finds C much more ridiculous than even I do.  Does your wife (if you have one) know about your obsession with constantly "defending" C?

As for the validity of which comment was funnier, it really is a matter of preference.  But allow me to break down the two for you.  C's play on words used Cravaak's first name of "Chip" and lazily added the word "Cow" prior to it creating the new nick-name of "Cow Chip."  While I admit that this is mildly amusing, my issue is more with the follow-up where she had to explain herself with the whole "...because he steps in shit..." thing.  She should have just let "Cow Chip" stand on it's own.  There is nothing worse than explaining a joke right after you've made it, especially when it's already so simplistic.  Also, need I point out that the pun is a reference to fecal matter, causing me to think that C is resorting to toilet humor in her assessment of Oberstar's opponent.  My comment was simply an observation on Oberstar's disturbingly wide stance at the contentious debate.

My comment = Observational humor

C's comment = Toilet humor

Tony D.

about 12 years ago

Danny:

Nope, no wife. But my girlfriend does understand I have little tolerance for fools.

jim

about 12 years ago

Tony-
A man may be a fool and not know it, but not if he is married. 
H. L. Mencken

Mojowoikin13

about 12 years ago

Oberstar should learn to read from a teleprompter - rather than speaking intelligently and extemporaneously, from his own knowledge reserves and heart?

Danny

about 12 years ago

"I have little tolerance for fools" is hilarious in it's pompacity.

Danny

about 12 years ago

I would like to take this opportunity to give a shout out to Danecdote, who started this topic.  Go to denecdote.com and download "Danthropology," which absolutely rules.

Claire

about 12 years ago

Seems to me that the Tea Partiers have to hurl juvenile insults at Congressman Oberstar because he doesn't speak in trite sound bites and utter Palinsesque platitudes like Cow Chip does.

Claire

about 12 years ago

Palinesque, I mean.

German Chris

about 12 years ago

I know I shouldn't comment, but come on Jim do you really believe the stuff your saying?  You seem like a halfway intelligent person.  You say:

"It was borked because of the money we spend on illegals daily"

You do know that paycheck withholding occurs with illegals as well as legals. Only these funds are never claimed because illegals don't get social security. These unclaimed funds amount to 6-7 billions of dollars annually.  They are funding our retirement benefits. Plus these illegals pay real estate taxes through the houses they own or the rent they pay. These taxes pay for some of the education costs of their children. Yet this is conveniently not discussed. Way to pick on unrepresented people and demonize them for the failing of our leadership. 

Next point:
"because of the lazy libs wanting lollipop mortgages orchestrated by the likes of Barney Frank"

I urge you to read factcheck.org's article on "Who Caused the Economic Crisis? Their underlying conclusion is: "The U.S. economy is enormously complicated. Screwing it up takes a great deal of cooperation. Claiming that a single piece of legislation was responsible for (or could have averted) the crisis is just political grandstanding. We have no advice to offer on how best to solve the financial crisis. But these sorts of partisan caricatures can only make the task more difficult." Of course we should rectify the mistakes, but to blame one side entirely is wrong.

You Jim are yourself a socialist by supporting the status quo of continued reliance on the automobile. Road projects in Minnesota cost 3.6 billion per annum. Most of this is paid by the gasoline tax and tabs. Roughly 1/3 of that sum (roughly 1 billion) is paid by local revenue like property taxes. That is a direct subsidy. If more drivers were to pay the true cost of driving then the interest in train travel would rise. Why can't we subsidize train travel? It worked with the light rail in the cities. (Despite all the Republicans continued nay saying)

By the way I am writing this while on a train in Germany sipping on a beer. I wish you both Baci and Jim and the rest could all enjoy the ride with me. 

http://www.businessweek.com/investor/content/apr2006/pi20060407_072803.htm
http://www.factcheck.org/2008/10/who-caused-the-economic-crisis/

Danny

about 12 years ago

Why is "progressing into the future" using a form of transportation that was invented well before the automobile?  I've yet to understand that.

Tony D.

about 12 years ago

German Chris:

A well-written, well-reasoned post. But alas, as I have learned, using logic, common sense, and the truth to appeal to Jim only results in him spewing other nonsensical vitriol in your direction, tossing random insults to those he fears along the way.

C'mon, Jim--whatcha got to say to German Chris? Whatcha gonna call him? Gonna say something is wrong with him if he is on a train in Germany, because that place is just full of foreigners, and they have a different word for everything and if the Euro fails because of England's socialized medicine and Amsterdam's legalized mara-ja-wana--and because France is part of Europe, and those frog surrender monkeys all hate freedom--all them there Germans will be pouring over the Canadian border (via the North Sea, Greenland, and Iceland--or maybe just U-Boats through the Great Lakes) to steal our jobs like those other illegals who forced us into this Great Recession! Is that what you're going to write?

Oooooh, I can't wait! This is so highly entertaining.

Thank You Sir, May I Have Another!

Danny

about 12 years ago

Settle down there, spaz.

Tony D.

about 12 years ago

That from a man who is so dull and unimaginative he can't see that no matter how old the mode of transportation, "progressing toward the future" is about making transportation (and a whole lot of other things) more economical and ecological and the world less dependent on petroleum. And in that department right now, modern trains have the advantage over automobiles.

Danny

about 12 years ago

Did you really have to say that while calling me dull and unimaginative?  Sheesh.  I see your point now.  You didn't need to hurt my feelings.

Tony D.

about 12 years ago

Sorry, Danny. Guess I was being a spaz.

Danny

about 12 years ago

Apology accepted.

baci

about 12 years ago

"BEERS ON A TRAIN!" .... C'mon Jim, isn't that alone enough to get you thinking as a progressive? I had crafted several replies to Jim but realized that it's pointless. The best thing about this post .. other than 

Deutsch Chris kennen zu Bier in einem Zug trinken und Schule ein Recht Flügelmutter-job 

... is that we've turned people talking about Oberstar's crotch into advocacy for socialism! Socialism is American.

Danny G

about 12 years ago

Allow me to bring it back to discussing Oberstar's crotch:


Ewww.



Thank you.

Baci

about 12 years ago

Another thought just struck me. 

@Jim. -  what you may not understand is that I consider it the greatest honor to share what ever meager "wealth" I may have with those less fortunate. This is the heart if true socialism and communal existence. This should be the driver of government.

double barrell darrell

about 12 years ago

It is your job, Jim.  You just can't do it.

double barrell darrell

about 12 years ago

BTW this is Mrs. Double Barrell Darrell speaking.

Danecdote

about 12 years ago

Logic is telling me, via these "smear campaigns," that no one has a good solution and that (yet again) the masters of puppets are pulling the strings.

Does any politician (since Ron Paul) really represent the interest of the people?

Danecdote

about 12 years ago

Alterior motives lurk around every corner.

Jim

about 12 years ago

That's the problem Baci- in your world, the government takes (steals) from those that have earned it and "gives" it to those who hasn't. People like you enjoy this system because it grants a license to underachieve and soak off of everyone else. That's why slums exist- it's self supporting. In my world, those that earn it give it to those that they feel deserve it, whether it's CHUM, their church, an addict on the street or their kids. That's the core of America, and the way it was founded. Hate to rain on your parade, but Marxism doesn't work, and your planned assimilation will never be more than a fantasy. Funny- if I actually believed in it, I'd swear you are a reincarnation of Karl Liebknecht. Anyway, I've gotten bored with with most of you. It's always the same old drivel and no longer amusing, except when Tony gets so worked up he has spittle on the corners of his mouth and he starts talking about his hairy legged girlfriend. I'll go back under my bridge now- but I will emerge again if someone starts tap dancing on my bridge. After a glorious election day, I'll probably come out and gloat a bit, so be ready with your sharp wit and bad german, Deutsche Bahn. (Nice ring to it, jå?)

German Chris

about 12 years ago

Danny ever heard of another Paul closer to home, Paul Wellstone? But Ron Paul is good to. I wish we had more of both.

Jim I love dancing on bridges. To say Baci is Karl Liebknecht reread history. Liebknecht was against socialists. He was a communist killed by socialists. But then again you may still not know the difference between socialist and communist. I pity the American public school system. 

It's funny, once again Jim is railing against the unrepresented. And talking out of his ass.  Welfare reform happened about 15 years ago.  Welfare (total budget 11 b/y) is hard to get long term now adays. Thank Clinton and the Repubs from the mid 90s. 

You'd think the big talking man Jim is he would take on a real fight. Corporate subsidies ($92b/y) or even farm subsidies ($20b/y) would suit a  man of his warmongering stature. But alas he seems brainwashed like all the rest of the right leaning trolls and keeps his sights low.

First thing businesses owners do is tackle their largest expenditures/losses first. You'd make a poor businessman Jim. You react on emotional issues. Your business model = fail.

zra

about 12 years ago

jim, i'd change your avatar before you return. toothless old cur is a far more fitting image.

what's there to gloat about when the pubes you elect turn out to be exactly like the pubes you hate...or even worse due to their complete ineptness and lack of even the basic understanding of how the government runs or how the Constitution works (belly laugh of the day: Michele "Bat Shit Crazy" Bachmann wants all lawmakers to take classes on the Constitution. I'm hoping her name is first on the list of attendees. What she knows about the document our country was founded on makes ME look like a fucking genius.)

your arguments are moot, twisted and under researched. you made it halfway, but lack the tenacity to go the distance as evidenced by the daily schooling you get when you pull out your old one-up.

keep it in your pants, bro.

whilst i'm at it...breadline? me? no. I love it when dickheads like you pull out that old "Youre going to fail" scare tactic. it's hilarious, chiefly because i've been beating that bullshit rap for a good chunk of my life. I could almost feel the spittle flying from your lips. you sounded mad...sounded like you wanted to teach me a lesson. sorry to disappoint. my financial security is quite...secure, and will continue to be so for decades to come. There aren't many here that do what I do, professionally, and there are fewer still who have more experience than me. WHEN I leave my place of employ, it will be at a time of my own choosing and of my own volition to pursue my own aspirations of business ownership, and I'm looking forward to growing old and fat living off the money that I've worked so hard and long for. The unfortunate part about all this is that you'll be long dead before i can prove you wrong.

baci-cutus of borg

about 12 years ago

rabid reactionaries run like rabbits when rebuffed with reason.

The vehemence of the fundamentalists is merely the death flailing of outmoded ideology. Now that Jim has admitted defeat, let's talk about a one world representative government. Since he has admitted that resistance to a more humane and progressive future is futile, the next logical step is for all the world's people to come together and use intelligence, good will and the principals of stewardship to guide our planet to sustainability, growth and expansion. The Green party is the ONLY populist global political organization!

BTW Jim, the bridge you hide under was built by the WPA during the last financial crisis. It was an infrastructure investment which brought jobs to the people, carried us out of the depression and left the country with 70 years of cool art-deco foundation for progress. It's crumbling now and should be re-built with political will and vision to take it another 70 years of sustainable multi-modal transportation use. We can even make a solar powered troll hovel for your types to hide in and cling to your hater ways.

Rob

about 12 years ago

Great thread.  German Chris is nailing it.  GC are you a Duluthian abroad?  If not how did you stumble on PDD?

German Chris

about 12 years ago

Yeah I have been finishing up a degree in Duisburg Germany for the last year. The only thing this city has in common with Duluth is that it begins with Du.  Can't wait to be back. 

Just have to see what jobs there will be.  Germany is enjoying better employment chances than the US. So finding a job here might be easier.

Danny

about 12 years ago

German Chris: I think you're confused.  Danny (me) and Danecdote are two different people.

Jim

about 12 years ago

"To say Baci is Karl Liebknecht reread history. Liebknecht was against socialists. He was a communist killed by socialists. But then again you may still not know the difference between socialist and communist. I pity the American public school system."

Another example of how truly stupid you all are. Liebknecht was a socialist, dummy. I think you need to go back to 7th grade history class. His extreme views (ie:Baci) turned him to pursuing a more agressive form of socialism, communism. There's the hook. Get it?? 

Zra, I love it when you talk naughty. Picking the corn out of the WLSSD tanks is a mighty unique job, I'll give you that. I'm sure it offers plenty of job security too! I'm sure you'll do great when you break out on your own. Feel free to come over to my place and pick until your hearts content. I might even pay you! 

Baci, I have nothing to say to you, other than maybe you should try dungeons and dragons. It will give you much more satisfaction than your current fantasy role playing! 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Liebknecht

zra

about 12 years ago

jim: all insult. no substance.

keep reaching for that rainbow.

Comrade baciknecht

about 12 years ago

troll = baited har har. Just wanted to see if I had the old charm.

Been playing D&D since 1975. Saved me from being an idiot... you should try it.

German Chris

about 12 years ago

Sorry I was mistaken Danny. Guess I need to learn to read. :)

"His extreme views (ie:Baci) turned him to pursuing a more agressive form of socialism, communism. "

Thanks for making my point Jim. If you would do due diligence and would have read past the first sentence of your link, you would have understood that Liebknecht helped found the German Communist Party in order to have a party which expressed his views.  No German would consider him anything "less aggresive" (to use your made-up political terminology) than a communist (I just asked 8, of which two did not know Liebknecht). By the way, I don't believe economists speak of more or less aggressive economic systems, but I could be wrong.

Baci outed himself as a market socialist. Communism advocates complete communal control over the means of production and distribution, whereas market socialism uses a free market to aid the distribution of the products.  Therefore, Baci ≠ Liebknecht.  

I know as an American it can be hard to believe that all these different forms of socialisms are different.  I had a hard time choosing who to vote for in Germany last May. But in countries with a more heterogeneous political makeup these differences are taken seriously. It makes our Weltanschauung as Americans harder. Voting here, however, is way more interesting. There was a Pirate Party for gods sake.

dbb

about 12 years ago

Voting is occasionally interesting here in the ol' USA.

For example, I wish I lived in New York. No one can argue with one of the one-plank political parties there. Certainly, the rent is too damn high.

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