Challenged Ballots in Minnesota

Mike Creger Dec 02, 2010 25 Comments

Here’s an afternoon killer: Take a look at the challenged ballots in the Minnesota governor’s race recount.

(The three above are from Aitkin County.)

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25 Comments

Heidi

about 13 years ago 

My fav so far, from LakeView Township in Becker County:



This is a time waster. :)

Spy1

about 13 years ago 

Yes. Double vision. From Mankato:

todobrillante

about 13 years ago 

Can someone explain why this one from Mankato is challenged?

double barrell darrell

about 13 years ago 

Emmer's people have stated that they realize the race is lost but are using this as a stall tactic to extend Pawlenty's term. Patriotic.

todobrillante

about 13 years ago 

Sorry about the double post: but this one also is unclear as to what the basis for the challenge is...
http://www.sos.state.mn.us/2010_governor_recount_challenged_ballots/Blue_Earth/BlueEarth_CityOfMankatoPct13_1.pdf

And this one seems desperate:
http://www.sos.state.mn.us/2010_governor_recount_challenged_ballots/Blue_Earth/BlueEarth_VernonCenterTwp_1.pdf

And I just don't understand why this one is being considered at all:
http://www.sos.state.mn.us/2010_governor_recount_challenged_ballots/Carver/Carver_BentonTwp_1.pdf

I have to be done looking at these or else my head will pop off 99% of the way and I will walk around looking like a hanging chad.

spy1

about 13 years ago 

Todo: It's obvious. There is a small mark in the Emmer oval, an obvious overvote. ; )

Lojasmo

about 13 years ago 

All complete bullshit.  Tony Sutton's stated goal is to challenge 8800 ballots. Period.

Jadiaz

about 13 years ago 

I'm OK with the ones being challenged in the original post. If you're too stupid to mark only one oval as the instructions state, your vote shouldn't count anyway. That being said, I would prefer Emmer as governor, but know Dayton won and am upset that Emmer is pulling this crap.

spy1

about 13 years ago 

I think a good many of those ballots have legit overvotes. If I had to guess, the language was tripping up people when it says to choose one "team." Some people took that to mean a person each from an oval and not the candidate and running mate alone. It should maybe say "fill in one oval for your candidate." But, yeah, people should know you can't have a Green Party lieutenant governor serving with Emmer.

Lojasmo

about 13 years ago 

Election rules state that those are frivolous challenges.  In accordance with the rulings by the election panel from 2008, intent can be clearly determined in all of these (except the one with all the circles filled in).

Stupid people get their votes counted, too.  As an Emmer supporter, you should be thankful for that.

Lojasmo

about 13 years ago 

"Mark Dayton attorney Marc Elias says the Tom Emmer campaign has been "disrespectful" of the recount process with the thousands of ballot challenges it has made. Most of those challenges have been deemed "frivolous" by election officials. In a letter sent to the State Canvassing Board, Elias asks the board to "put an end to this irresponsible conduct, bring the recount to an orderly conclusion, and promptly certify the results of this election."

The letter also said Dayton would withdraw all 42 of the ballot challenges it has made that election officials have deemed "frivolous."

The Canvassing Board is meeting tomorrow at 2pm to discuss the thousands of frivolous challenges.

theuptake.org

Rougement

about 13 years ago 

Simple solution: a ballot may be challenged but if the challenge is deemed unsuccessful then a vote is removed from the challenger's tally. 

That should put an end to this kind of abuse.

Jadiaz

about 13 years ago 

Hey Lojasmo, if you read my post I feel Emmer needs to stop the recounts because Dayton won. Voting is pretty easy and if you can't do it right your vote doesn't count. Pretty simple concept. Calling an entire group of people stupid for voting for a certain candidate doesn't make your position seem that great. You aren't swaying me to the Democratic side of the aisle by showing how tolerant and intelligent they are with your post.

Bad Cat!

about 13 years ago 

I was randomly clicking around on a few ballots and just getting more and more pissed off. I decided to look at just one more, and am so glad I did!

My Favorite Contested Ballot so far! (the fun is on the second page)

edgeways

about 13 years ago 

fwiw Jadiaz I was an election judge this past cycle, and the two previous as well, observing who comes in and votes, and watching them sign their name I'd wager large amounts of cash that stupidity isn't the underling factor in many of the making errors. Poor sight and hand tremors due to age or disability would account for the overwhelming majority of marking errors. Now, the question is, can YOU discern from the ballot who was stupid and who has low vision and thought they marked the ballot correctly?
Additionally, opening the door to only allowing those above the certain bar of intelligence to vote is dicey at best... talk about what a government overreach that would be.

Jadiaz

about 13 years ago 

I don't feel there needs to be a test to vote. There are already regulations in place for who is eligible. What my opinion is, is that if you can't mark your ballot correctly, your not to intelligent, and your vote doesn't count. Whether you are old, disabled, or plain stupid, there are several things in place to help you cast your vote correctly. If you don't take advantage of those things and mark the ballot wrong you have no one to blame but yourself. The examples above are not marked correctly and therefore should not be counted. It is the system in place and it works.

Bad Cat!

about 13 years ago 

Anyone else see the irony in this? "your not to intelligent"

Keep in mind that many people voting could be from different areas that have different voting standards, may have English as a second language, may have Dyslexia or other learning disabilities that affect reading and comprehension, or honestly may have a low IQ. Do you want to be the one to propose an IQ limit for who has a say in representation and who doesn't? Reminds me a bit of the excuses used in the segregated south.

Jadiaz

about 13 years ago 

Again I am not proposing an IQ limit. I'm satisfied with the standards we have. If you can't mark a ballot properly it doesn't count. You guys are the ones reading to much into my statements. If I mark my ballot wrong it shouldn't count. If a person has a disability, there are services to help them vote, if they still mark their ballot wrong, it shouldn't count. What is so complicated about not counting ballots with multiple marks?

todobrillante

about 13 years ago 

If you mess up while filling out your ballot can you request a new blank one and have the election judges recycle your mistake? If so, there's no reason for marking one, crossing it off, and then marking another...other than having too much pride to admit you f'd up and need a new ballot.

Bad Cat!

about 13 years ago 

But state law does not require a ballot to be filled out 100% correct in order to be counted. Ballots that are unclear are reviewed and if voter intent can be determined, then it is counted.
Voter intent is clear in this ballot so it should count as a vote.
Voter intent is not clear in this ballot so it should not count as a vote.

calk

about 13 years ago 

I was a ballot recount observer during the Franken-Coleman brouhaha two years ago. Bad Cat! is right, it's about voter intent. If a reasonable person can determine the voter's intent, that ballot should stand. People should not be penalized for making mistakes, changing their minds, or for disabilities. I shouldn't have to worry that if I don't fill in the oval perfectly and completely, that my ballot will be thrown out.

Jadiaz, before you start going off at the mouth about how people should mark their ballots perfectly or be disenfranchised, perhaps you should be an observer (the official title is poll challenger) at your precinct or elsewhere. You'd witness the incredible variety of people coming in to vote -- some of them for the first time. And the polling place can be frantic at time, esp. b/c Minnesotans vote. It's not always easy for convenient for voters to say they screwed up and ask for another ballot, when there's a huge line of voters being helped already.

 I assume, to answer Todobrillante's question if you do request another ballot, that the judge would tear it up and give you another one. I remember someone leaving their ballot on a table after voting when I was a challenger a few years ago, and one of the election judges running out to find that person (they couldn't) -- so the ballot was destroyed.

Terry G.

about 13 years ago 

I forgot my reading glasses when I voted this time. Maybe I was right to worry that I didn't precisely fill in the ovals.

edgeways

about 13 years ago 

*shrug* as has already been stated the standard is "clear intent", not "fuck you if you make a mistake". And yeah, dude, if you are going to advocate for strict interpretations, you may want to be a bit mindful of grammatical errors. I _am NOT_ saying you are stupid, but taken to the logical extension of your argument you, yourself, may have done so.

Lojasmo

about 13 years ago 

Jadiaz:  you clearly have not read Minnesota law.  The standards we have are inconsistent with your claims.

Lojasmo

about 13 years ago 

If one asks for a duplicate (I did, and was refused) the original ballot is numbered, and set aside, and both are saved. (I participated in both recounts.) 

If a ballot has an over or under marked race, that race is not counted ... except in the case of a recount.

But if voter intent can be clearly determined, in the case of a recount, it shall be counted according to Minnesota law.

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