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A Modest Proposal


Let me start by saying that I am posting this on both Duluth Citizens Blog and Perfect Duluth Day at the same time. Lately, we’ve all been witness to a string of hatred on both sites towards the regular posters and proprietors of the supposed opposing blog. Members of PDD and DCB both have participated in accusations, name-calling, and general anger towards regular posters whom they feel are in the wrong. It has gotten out of control.

On today’s episode of my equally maligned (by many members of both sites) podcast DANNY DOES DULUTH a thought came up to propose some sort of an inter-site, public summit where members of both DCB and PDD can get together and try to solve the issues causing so much tension. After thinking about it for a few hours, I’m now beginning to realize that maybe this is something that can become more than just a thought, but an actual concept. My proposal is this: sometime in the month of June we set aside a specific day, most-likely on a Saturday during early evening hours where we all get together and try to just get along. The venue would be an agreed upon bar in town, somewhere we can all be comfortable. I am happy to field suggestions as to the locale. Also, I would like to know who has the courage and honesty to attend an event such as this. In my mind, a minimum of 5-10 people from both sites would be needed in the interest of fairness and variety of conversation. Please contact me by either replying to this post, commenting on this post, or sending me an email to [email protected] if you are interested in attending an event such as this. I see it as a win-win situation.


I'd be happy to show up in the interest of glasnost, but I'm probably a poor candidate due to my frequent ranting and flying off the handle...

A fair proposal and one I will accept. However, I'm afraid no one from the DCB would show. They have pretty much made it known they do not want their identities known.

My god. This could be the clash of the titans of Duluth Blogs. Will the press conference be open to the public?

When you're a Jet, you're a Jet all the way.

I have the feeling it may be strangly civil. The internet allows the depersonalization of those you are attacking. Someone wouldn't even think about typing something horrible about a person, but could never say the same words to a person's face.
We'll probably all be "Minnesota Nice" (once the fight for the locale is over).

No thanks, I don't want my daughter to grow up without a mother.

Yeah, where should we meet though? Chester Creek Cafe or Blackwoods?

Seriously, though, why meet? Your only connection is that you've said horrible things about one another over the Internet. It can't really be to "make peace," because this kind of bullying phenomenon has been around as long as the Internet. As long as we post in public forums, we will always have our tormentors. Isn't the best course of action to not participate in the bickering in the first place?

Good luck, either way.

I roger what Roger said. Hell I don't want to meet anyone period much less someone from either PDD or DCB. Shit I think I got some kind of cancer growing on my arm! WTF!

Being civil? that's not entertaining, I propose there be a steel cage match.

s'fine with me. It is always harder to slam someone after you meet them face to face.

If any DCBers want to have a beer I'm game.

Roger's got a good point. So we go out together, meet "the other blog", have a few beers, and then what? Do we seriously think this is going to be some after-school special where doves come flying out of our asses as the sun shines?
Let's buy them enough beer ensure that Starfire gets his name back and then go back to our corners to brood.

But the counter then is, why not? I certainly hope no doves come out my ass, and, sure there is no guarantee things will magically be tones better. But, so what? They might be better, and as much as either site seems to love to hate on one another it might put a dent in it.

I guess if people are happy to remain wrapped up in their social circles and not make an effort then that's fine, I'm certainly am not "Mr gregarious" but see no harm in spending an hour out of my life to possibly save the never ending tediousness of reading or hearing about inane writings of people who don't know me.

DDD, it's an interesting offer. I don't know that I'm qualified to be a part of this "summit", but i'd happily go and participate. I agree with a previous poster that the DCB people will not show up. Whether it's because there is only four of them or because they can't be both known and so full of hate at the same time. DDD's characterization of the events that proceed this summit is troublesome to me though. I find no similarities to the actions at each respective sites. For example, Rob F is my name, both on this site and at work, and on my drivers license. My friends call me Rob. Similarly, Edgeways and Starfire, to pick on two regular posters here, both are commonly referred to online and in real life by their respective handle, Starfire even uses his name in his business. So by in large the community of posters here have readily specific and transparent monickers. Not so on the DCB, The DCB community is founded with anonymity. I know some of the people that post on that site - do I know for sure which person in real life goes by their anonymous handle - no. But i know that I know people that post there, and I know through prose and stylistic similarities that they use multiple handles. In short, Ben Dover, Numbers Cruncher, voter, Tara, BS, casual observer, pitt street, etc, do not refer to themselves as that at work or even at the bar at Blackwoods with their friends. That much I know for sure. If they did then they wouldn't be anonymous. If they lose their anonymity they lose all their perceived power. The site would either: become civil, or become vacant. So to compare these two sites as equal is a false premise. And to quote Rumsfeld, "you're beginning with an illogical premise and proceeding perfectly logically to an illogical conclusion" For what it's worth I have posted in the past at the DCB under 'Rob' and I would say that 20% gets posted. So I have tried to used my name there as well. This is only one of the many differences, the other major one is the censorship of ideas - posts here get loaded without modification and adulteration - I presume it's moderated for SPAM and cleaned up after the post is public. I'd help put this event together, but I can't see how or why they would attend.

Don't do it, it is just an attention grab on their part. I wish you guys would just ignore DCB, they aren't worth the trouble.

I dont get what you mean. AN attention grab on WHO'S part? I made the proposal independantly of the DCB or the PDD. And besides, there hasnt been much of a response so far to the proposed meet-up from anyone on the DCB.

Is there some trust fund i am not preasently aware of? If there is, I want my cut!!! I agree with the post above about the DCBers not showing up. They are way more comfortable tossing epithets out of their bunker of anonymity. I really don't know how serious some of the ape's are over there but if they are, they could be THE dumbest group of fuckers ever allowed to own a computer! i have not met many of the posters on here but I would be at this "summit" and ready to roll!

The idea that you could have some type of summit between members of PDD and the DCB is just stupid. First of all, the anonymous DCB cowards would never choose to reveal their true identities. Does anyone in Duluth know an Anthony or Tony Ramone? You don't because there isn't a single Anthony Ramone in Minnesota or Wisconsin. Secondly, why should the PDD folks meet with the assholes who call the PDD the Duluth Rump Runners? Sorry Danny, but your an idiot.

It's "you're an idiot" not "your an idiot".


Damn, I made a grammar mistake. By pointing it out Danny, you proved that you are indeed an asshole! My grammatical mistake can't turn YOUR stupid idea into one that makes sense. YOU ARE an idiot!

It's a bit more than a grammar mistake when you make it while calling someone an idiot.

But whatever. Let's move on.

Pitt Street Resident, Victim Detector, Tony Ramone and I will be unable to attend, as we will be waxing each other's backs in my frothy, steaming hot tub.

What about me, Ben? Why wasn't I invited?

I'm not talking to you, JBBP. Maybe you didn't notice me in the corner when you were grabbing Big Iron's ass, but I saw the whole thing. You're not welcome in my hot tub any more.

Just for your information, Ben, JBBP and I are friends, AND THAT'S IT!


Surely, Benjamin, you should know by now that my name is Pitt Street Panther, not Pitt Street Resident.

Shall I bring my toys to the party?

That would be wonderful, Pitt. And if you could also bring three gallons of guacamole and a piping bag, I have a very interesting proposal I've been meaning to talk to you about.

Consider it done, kind sir!

I agree with Zoyx...DCB is not worth the effort. At most there are 5 people that have a vested interest in keeping it running.

There is no comparison with PDD. I disagree that it would be a "Battle of the Titans".

PDD is the only titan. Ignore them.

Danny...I know your intentions are well meant but the chief problem with the idea is that, as Rob, Roger and others have pointed out, the DCB not only thrives on but depends on the anonymity of its posters to maintain any amount of perceived "power" at all...which of course isn't power at all. A meeting, however casual, would only serve to remove said anonymity and force their bloggers (however many there may be) to be held accountable for their words and actions...and as such, i regard him/them as cowards, unwilling to own up to what they say.

I can address Starfire, Edgewood, Barrett or any of the others here by name and face because I know who they are. I know where they live. They are real people who exist. Ben, Pitt and the rest are manifestations of a few (and I do mean FEW) angry, sick, and frustrated individuals and therefore don't exist. Their table would only require two or three chairs, whereas ours...you'd need to reserve a section.

It's true, the internet does indeed dehumanize us, chiefly by removing accountability. If Ben or Tony or whoever he claims to be this week were to make those types of statements in a public place (such as a bar for example) there'd be little he could do to prevent himself from being dragged into the street and beaten to a pulp.

Reading the DCB is akin to listening to the thoughts of a handful of gutless, bitter, aging shutins who for some reason feel that the system has let them down. They're pissed because their world is changing and there is absolutely nothing they can do to stop it, save vent their frustrations about their government, the people around them and the people who're changing their city by anonymous slander.

I'll admit that I've been frustrated at his attempts to focus his aggression on my friends and my community (i'm used to people talk shit about me personally...), and I do get offended when He refers to me as a parasite on His city, but in reality the DCB is a prime example of allowing ones anger to get away from them...

You sir, have more balls than the rest simply because you have allowed your identity to be verified...and as such are deserving of at least some amount of respect, simply because you are willing to shake hands and have a beer with any one of us. I doubt that you'd receive the same from Tony and the rest of his avatars.

Well, I'm going to keep trying with both parties on this. However, threats of violence against the opposing side isnt really going to help the cause.

I've said it before and I'll say it again...

PDD vs. DCB kickball game.

I say the Blue Crab in the West End. (Or Duluth's stunningly redeveloped Lincoln Park Business District, if you prefer.)

Or Curlys.

Danny, I wasn't really threatening violence against these guys, it was mainly for example...frankly they're not worth the bloodied knuckles or the time spent dealing with the legal ramifications of a sound thrashing.

besides, it wouldn't do any good. you can't pound respect into a man any more than you can teach him common sense or reason him out of an opinion that he hasn't reasoned himself into.

Danny, Zra's totally correct in his assessment of the DCBers. So Why in god's name are you even bothering to attempt some kind of rapprochement? I, frankly, would rather pound my head against a brick wall than attempt any kind of discussion with those people. Life is just too short to put up with mean people.

"Us vs. Them" is so childish.

Can't we all just get along?

That's what I'm saying, pistoffnick.

zra = win!

You are the best and I love your coffee! Keep it up!

thanks for the encouragement but...i wasn't trying to win anything, really...shit, i ain't perfect. i'm probably the most hypocritical schmuck you're gonna hear from with regard to this whole ordeal, that's because i love to argue and tend to push it as far as I can when i do.
it's a fault that, sadly, i'm stuck with.

thanks for drinkin' the coffee too...really. knowing i'm jump-starting peoples' day and giving them a kick when the cobwebs creep in totally makes me happy. that goes for the coffee snobs, too.

Maybe we should just eat babies instead.


Hmmm? What?

Are you awake?

Yes, darling.

Last night was wonderful, Ben. I just wanted you to know.

It takes two to make things wonderful, Vic.

What are you guys whispering about? Come on, give me some blankets. Big Iron, get off my leg!


Get off my leg. It's not comfortable.

That's not me. It's JBBP.

JBBP is here?

Yeah, right there. Under Voter.

Oh, I see him now. He looks so peaceful when he's sleeping. You'd never guess what he was capable of.

And don't go telling everybody, either, Tommy. He belongs with us.

Oh, Ben Dover...

Oh, Victim Detector...

Oh, Big Iron...

Oooooooooooh, Tom A.....

I really appreciate the sentiment of this proposal. But ... dang if this DCB vs. PDD dust-up isn't just about the most interesting thing in my daily internet travels lately. Even if it is through a virtual throwdown, one that has no end in sight (and no point for that matter) its great to see people actually communicating across the imaginary lines in this town.

That said, those last 7 or 8 (anonymous) posts seem a bit more like outright homophobia and less like thoughtful satire. You might want to get that looked at ... you could have a problem worse than the folks on the other side of the fence ... Don't want to lose the moral high ground now, do we?

This entire board here with the exception of a few posts was all done by Danny from Danny Does Duluth.

If any of you even think about meeting with him you might as well just agree with the DCB then. Danny is exactly what DCB is doing by doing fake voices for local people. He had "Donny Ness" on his show and used a voice to make Ness look like an idiot.

Starfire, let this drop and don't let Daniel J Golden and his list of alternative personalities rip into you.

Danny Does Duluth is sort of Funny in a sad way, but he does exactly what DCB does to even a greater extent.

Go back to your corner Danny and get the hell out of PDD. Keep with your own people on the DCB and stop trying to promote your lame podcast here. We told you to leave before...

Poor Starfire, you should have let this drop and not even posted on PDD about it. As you can see it only gets worse if you feed these little people who's only exsistance is to live off of making fun of people they don't know.

I personally know that Daniel J. Golden is a closet visitor to the Family Sauna in Duluth every Monday for college night. He likes to wear a stripped town and go after the ones who like "chubby chasers".

What is a "stripped town"?

Danny come on... Don't you know a "stripped town" is your little secret word for the outfit you wear?

See you at the Sauna on Monday "Big Gulp"... That is Danny's nickname at the Sauna. Maybe the whole "meeting" thing should happen there? If some women want to get in on the action we can get a private room upstairs for when things get "heated".

No one, and I mean NO ONE, sucks like Danny does!

I am the super lame voice that Daniel J. Golden does on his show that no one listens to called Danny Does Duluth.

Because his humor is that of a 5 year old I have decided to leave his show. Dear Danny, I QUIT! I thought you were straight, but then I hear you visit the Sauna. I wondered where you went on Monday Nights...

Danny Does Duluth sucks and no one should listen to it... AND I AM A CHARACTER ON THE SHOW! I should know, as I am Daniel J Golden-Showers alter ego/lame voice.

Please stop recording my voice on your show!

Can someone divorce themself?

Ok fine, I admit it... I go to the Sauna down town... I only go because I am really cold in the winter... and... Monday happens to be my night off.

I know my show sucks, which is why I come here and live off of what you other people say. I am just like DCB, and as a matter of fact... I hate you PDD people.

You people think you are so cool, but in reality you are lame! Geek Prom, really?

A 40 year old complaining about their name and going to a Prom.. more like LOSER-PROM..

You people on PDD are the lamest in town. Your little Homegrown sucks, your causes are lame, and your art and comics are that of a 5 year old.

Vee no nuzeeng at all aboot ze Dalooth Zitizeens Blawg!